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-   -   Polynesian and Japanese 3/4 sleeve - need help with background (http://www.bigtattooplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23167)

pllefrancois 07-07-2012 03:54 PM

Polynesian and Japanese 3/4 sleeve - need help with background
 
3 Attachment(s)
Hi all !
I recently started my first 3/4 sleeve. The bottom part is polynesian/samoan tribal and the top part is japanese. there is only a couple retouch and another black filling session and the polynesian part will be finished.
I had the lining of the japanese part done a couple days ago. I have to wait for it to heal and then we will do the background first as it is all black and gray and we dont want to make the drawings too dark. We want the background to be darker than the drawings themself.
I am undecided on the background. I do like the japanese waves backgrouns but if this is what i choose I think that by adding a bit of red ink in the black ink, we could create a little bit more depth. What do you think ?
Do you have any other suggestions on the background ? I am really undecided.
Dont look at the drawings the shading isnt done and it does not even look like what it is suppose to look.
Thanks all this is really appreciated !

Diezel_FW 07-07-2012 06:27 PM

I would recommend laser treatment on the Japanese parts at the top, and then start again, but all polynesian, it will look a thousand times better. Mixing these two styles is almost never really going to look great. The artist clearly knows next to nothing about Japanese tattooing, and has done a very, very, VERY poor job so far. Everything is too small, badly placed, and badly lined. I would seriously consider some laser treatment on what you currently have, and then finding a good quality artist who knows a bit about Japanese artwork and tattoos.

bamz 07-07-2012 08:10 PM

I usually don't talk wack, but that thing, that's supposed to be a koi, is let's say... not good at all.
I wouldn't worry about the background and listen to Diesel_FW's advice.
If you proceed with the rest of the tattoo... and do it with the tattooist that has done this to you, than you would end up with one real bih piece of sh*t, that eventually will be regretted by you for the rest of your life.

Danny Brown 07-07-2012 10:19 PM

i agree with everything said so far and would like to add that the carp is already SOOOO dark with the heavy and cramped lining that will spread even more that if you go dark background then....... actually i can't be bothered to continue. basically it'll look crap

miltonfox 08-07-2012 06:22 AM

the koi is a total mess mate far to much scales

sorry it looks terrible

pllefrancois 08-07-2012 11:54 PM

Lets just say that the wacky lines are the way i WANTED this to look. A perfect tatoo would not even be close to the meaning behind the piece. Quality of the tattoo is not the thing i worring about. The quality is way better than the drawing looks like. The lines are not good because this is the way i wanted it to look. the koi has more scales than normal due to a personal choice. the drawings are not in the perfect positions but they NEEDED to be placed like this in order for the meaning of the tattoo to be what i wanted it to be. The piece is barely started. anyway the tattoo is not for others... it's for me. :)
The thing is it's not suppose to be a JAPANESE tattoo, it's suppose to be a japanese inspired tattoo. I knew from the beginning that the two styles would be hard to fit together but those two styles are from two different cultures that I identify myself to. This was very important for me to incorporate those two styles in the piece.

Danny Brown 09-07-2012 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pllefrancois (Post 668909)
Lets just say that the wacky lines are the way i WANTED this to look. A perfect tatoo would not even be close to the meaning behind the piece. Quality of the tattoo is not the thing i worring about. The quality is way better than the drawing looks like. The lines are not good because this is the way i wanted it to look. the koi has more scales than normal due to a personal choice. the drawings are not in the perfect positions but they NEEDED to be placed like this in order for the meaning of the tattoo to be what i wanted it to be. The piece is barely started.

ummm... yet your asking where to go next with it?????

pllefrancois 09-07-2012 12:43 AM

I asking about the backgroung.. not the drawings into the piece. Not that I need to explain it but let me get it down for you.
Those drawings were drawn by a little girl that was seriously injured by the tsunami in thailand. I used to be working for an NGO working to help that kind of people and I was in charge of the team taking care of her. She unfortunately died a couple months after the tsunami. So this is why the drawings were so important to me and i wated to keep them IDENTICAL size, shape and placement. (She drew those on my arm with a pen, right where they are tattooed. The number of scales on the koi represent the number of bodies i came across while working in thailand. I wanted to keep the size of the drawing but wanted to incorporate this exact number of scales.
I am not here to get judge on the decisions i made regarding the shape and origins of the drawings....
I just need help to find a kind of background that would make those drawings pop out.

peterjsmyth 29-07-2012 10:26 AM

well said, people are to concerned how it looks and not the meaning behind the tatt its just tattoo snobbery. you could go with lotus flowers with some light waves

Rosco5 29-07-2012 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterjsmyth (Post 670368)
well said, people are to concerned how it looks and not the meaning behind the tatt its just tattoo snobbery. you could go with lotus flowers with some light waves

Sorry but if you think wanting a tattoo to look good is 'snobbery' you don't any business being on this site.

peterjsmyth 29-07-2012 11:57 AM

instead of giving the guy advice you all critised hes tatt and that is snobbery.

Rosco5 29-07-2012 02:10 PM

Then don't come back, no one is forcing you. By the sounds of it it doesn't sound like your input is particularly needed.

And sorry, but a sleeve is not a 'tatt', it's a collection of tattoos that cover your entire arm, and an entire arm is a hell of a canvas to fill with something mediocre just because it's got a meaning behind it. If I'm a snob because I don't think defending ugly tattoos because of sentimental meaning is a working defence then that's fine. I'm simply under the impression that sentimental tattoos can look good as well, sorry if that makes me a snob in your mind, your attitude makes you a troglodyte in mine.

People here can be harsh, but that's because we have a collection of talented tattoo artists, people who have been travelling up and down the country to get the very best tattoos and people who truly love tattoos in general. People here are looking at the best in the industry, surely you knew that before you came here? Sorry if that seems harsh, but what's the point in advising someone to continue something they find ugly? It's not going to work, it's going to look horrible, maybe a little harshness now will save a lot of regret in the future.

Diezel_FW 29-07-2012 05:49 PM

I dont think all I did was criticise, I gave advice, the exact same advice I would have given if he has walked into my studio in person. I gave my honest opinion, I am not going to lie for the sake of politeness. If it all means a lot to him, and he likes it, then good luck to him. My opinion is not needed.

qertyuiop 29-07-2012 06:40 PM

What is that thing just above the Polynesian im trying to work it out and cant tell what it is?????

Sleever 29-07-2012 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qertyuiop (Post 670391)
What is that thing just above the Polynesian im trying to work it out and cant tell what it is?????

I think it's a frog.

qertyuiop 29-07-2012 10:09 PM

thats one shit tattoo of a frog lol

Sleever 30-07-2012 03:51 PM

I'm sorry, but it sounds pretty weird to me that a small girl designs by her own a Koi. (!?!?). And I didn't get the connections with the maori style.
I think it's just an excuse. But since I can't be sure of this, I just take it as it is.
If you are happy, bro, I'm happy for you.

DonGori 30-07-2012 04:22 PM

Inspiration
 
Hi!

Well, first of all I agree with most others in this thread. This tattoo looks very bad! But If the guy likes it and it's the way he wanted it then congratulations. Also I must say I don't really believe the story about the girl either. But hey, it really doesn't concern me. Maybe you can get some inspiration from this video:
A Guide To Japanese Tattoos - YouTube

dougal 31-07-2012 12:01 PM

If you want help with good designs in a polynesian style contact rpacheo.

And maybe calm down and stop taking offence to stuff that is basically opinion. But bear in mind this opinion is of professional artists and avid collectors. They do have a lot of knowledge to share.

pllefrancois 07-08-2012 11:03 PM

its not wanting a tattoo that looks good that is snobbery... it's judging other's tattoos on how they look... everyone's tattoo has personal meanings and people like different things and looks.. the whole point of that thread is not about bitching other people..it's about helping me find a kind of background that would make the drawings popout!!!
But snobbery here we mean telling people yours is better,,, but better to who ? you ? I am never gonna tell somebody their tattoo is not good. I might say i would not personnaly wear it but never that it's not a good design.
you guys keep judging my decisions on the drawings i included in the sleeve.. this is not why i am here..

Rosco5 07-08-2012 11:21 PM

Then you're clearly in the wrong place, sorry.

Not telling people they've made a bad decision is ridiculous - is the world supposed to be full of people too afraid to say what they really think? Tough, sorry but that's how it goes. People here are used to dealing with the best, does that make them snobs? It means that they care, if you're offended you need to grow a pair and go find a bunch of sycophantic yes folk who will tell you what you want to hear.

Personally, I think you've been really silly because no way in hell does Japanese ever mix well with Polynesian, also your Japanese is ugly as sin. Nothing is going to make that 'pop'; it's crap! Anything you do now will just make it look more of a scribble. Call me a snob, doesn't make me any less right.

pllefrancois 07-08-2012 11:23 PM

I don't care if you believe it or not.. the drawings were really drawn by her and weither you believe it or not is not gonna change the memory i have of my time oversea. there is no excuses at all in my posts as I don't need to excuse myself for a tattoo that I actually do like. What I am certain of is that I don't know where yall from but where i am from we don't laugh at people's tattoos. And the tattoo was never meant to make people on a forum love it... It was meant for me to make a lifelong commitment to an event of my past that litteraly changed my life forever. And just for information, i never said she drew them straight out of her head, she tried to copy the tattoos of a book, The only thing we did was add the little details like the eyes and the scales.. The drawing look childish because THEY WERE DRAWN BY A KID. And for you guys to question a very important part of the life of a stranger is VERY VERY disrespectfull !!! I cannot believe that people of our modern world are still making fun of others. You guys are not even trying to help me, you keep making fun of it and judging me. If you don't have something related to the reason of that thread to say then get the hell out of here.. For people to give suggestions on lasering it is fine and is giving advice but to tell me that my tattoo is ugly and poor, is very childish. I like better having a childish tattoo on my entire arm then listening to people that think their taste is the best and only option..

Rosco5 07-08-2012 11:29 PM

Yeah, I heard you the first time, I still think you're full of shit.

I had two ugly black stars on my arm, used to justify them by saying they were in memory of two people who died. Since I got them covered up I no longer say that.

Seriously, grow some fucking bollocks mate. You're getting really pathetic now.

pllefrancois 07-08-2012 11:32 PM

it does not HAVE to be japanese... i read my first post and i expressed myself not the way i wanted. I do appreciate the advice on getting lasered but not the way you tell me to.. i don't like how picasso painted but i would NEVER say it's crap.. do you understand what i mean ? I am not mad that you tell me you dont like it and suggest laser, I am mad because you question weither the meaning behind it is true or not and because of the way you talk to people.. there are a few areas i am open to a coverup but some not.. i am not entired closed to the idea of throwing the japanese style by the window. the two most important things in the piece are the turtle and the koi. Weither it looks like a koi or not is not a problem, as long as i know where it's coming from it's all that matters..

Rosco5 07-08-2012 11:38 PM

You're not going to get any positive comments here about it, sorry, maybe you should go somewhere else.

And really, what tattoo artist sets out to make a tattoo look intentionally bad and childish? How is that going to look to prospective customers when they see that in the portfolio?

I think you've clearly not understood the place you've come to here, look around, look at some of the tattoos people here have. It's world class work, by world class artists. Telling them they have no right to insult what you have is actually rather ignorant of you; if you wanted people to agree with you why didn't you just go to friends and ask their opinions?

pllefrancois 07-08-2012 11:45 PM

i don't want people to agree with me.. i want people to develop some manners..and sorry about this but if i want the tattoo to look childish this is what i'm gonna get.. i'm not getting a tattoo to make the reputation of the artist better,,, i am getting a tattoo for me,, and just for information... NOBODY has the right to insult others.. Tattoo artists do not have the right more than others.. do you really think you have the right to insult other people ?! Now this is childish for real. People commit suicide because of that kind of attitude, people get depressions because of that kin of attitude, Grow up man.,. nobody is better than others... even if they have a tattoo you dont like

Rosco5 07-08-2012 11:55 PM

Um, don't ever tell me to grow up when you throw a pathetic little hissy fit because you can't take criticism.

Why don't you grow a set of balls, take your ugly tattoos and sod off?

Nobody has the right to insult others? Fuck off, what a load of pamby fucking nonsense. Everyone in the world is supposed to be nice to each other? Yeah right, fuck off back to Narnia or The Shire or whatever fairyland of happy make believe you clearly come from.

People don't kill themselves over harsh criticism - in fact, if you had half a fucking brain you'd realise that most people who are told their tattoos are ugly either realise it and go get something nicer or else defend them to the death. You clearly need a spine mate.

pllefrancois 08-08-2012 12:22 AM

wow.. this is not even funny... you tell me that he personally have the right to insult others is ridiculous. Each individuals on the planet have the right to respect. but i am starting to think you personally do not deserve respect.. you are telling me my life story is a big fake excuse for a tattoo.. why the hell would i excuse myself for something i like just because a dumb disrespectfull asshole do not like it.. im sorry but your opinion do not even matter.. even if you told me you liked it i would have taken it into concideration.. this is ridiculous.. you think you are better then everyone just because you covered up two stars that you use to tell lies about. I spent a total of 3 years in south east asia and i am more than proud of what i did !!!!! I am helping others to get a better life when all you do is sitting at home on your computer telling others they are bullshit.. i hope one day you realize that you are the bullshit. You seem to be a very intelligent person.. you just have a head bigger than your opinions.

Rosco5 08-08-2012 01:06 AM

Then go elsewhere, no one's making you stay here.

pllefrancois 08-08-2012 01:21 AM

i do appreciate everyones imput... except yours.. you are rude, disrespectfull and annoying

pllefrancois 08-08-2012 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diezel_FW (Post 670388)
I dont think all I did was criticise, I gave advice, the exact same advice I would have given if he has walked into my studio in person. I gave my honest opinion, I am not going to lie for the sake of politeness. If it all means a lot to him, and he likes it, then good luck to him. My opinion is not needed.

i do appreciate your imput mate. I just dont like when people are rude. You were both still respectful but critical. You gave advice which is appreciated. Others aren't giving advice, they just make fun of my life. I appreciate you being honest, yet respectful. I told a story of my past that affected me very much and you are the only one who did not doubt it. Thank you.

qertyuiop 08-08-2012 10:17 AM

Dude you cant even tell what some of the work is...it looks terrible, just google a japense koi sleeve and see the quality that they are.

look at the links that is a top quality tattoo http://www.bigtattooplanet.com/forum...ealed-new-pics

Rosco5 08-08-2012 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pllefrancois (Post 671138)
i do appreciate everyones imput... except yours.. you are rude, disrespectfull and annoying

And you're a whiny little crybaby with crap tattoos, why are you still here?

By the way, here's my point; I didn't lie about the influence of the black stars. Here's the thing though, I don't know you, I'm on the internet taking your word for something that may or may not have happened. You don't know if I lied, I can't tell if you are, because neither of us really know for sure.

Also, why does it upset you if you know it's true?

jonah212121 08-08-2012 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diezel_FW (Post 668829)
I would recommend laser treatment on the Japanese parts at the top, and then start again, but all polynesian, it will look a thousand times better. Mixing these two styles is almost never really going to look great. The artist clearly knows next to nothing about Japanese tattooing, and has done a very, very, VERY poor job so far. Everything is too small, badly placed, and badly lined. I would seriously consider some laser treatment on what you currently have, and then finding a good quality artist who knows a bit about Japanese artwork and tattoos.

Totally agree!!!!!!! sorry dude :(:confused::(

jonah212121 08-08-2012 02:46 PM

No need to argue on here guys..... Im sorry the criticism of the tattoo IMO is deserved. I LOVE Japanese tattoos and I dont mind polynesian but IMO they should never be mixed..... If your very lucky they will look like two totally separate tattoos (forearm + upper arm) It is totally up to you tho at the end of the day its YOUR body. I think people on here are just worried you will regret the decision to stick with the idea. I have alot of friends and family with dreadful tattoos but id never tell them on here its far easier for people to be opinionated. Hopefully you make the right decision for you and dont live to regret it. GOOD LUCK 8-)

Rosco5 08-08-2012 03:07 PM

Sorry, I got offended because I hate being told I can't be critical of anything.

I'm not about being nice for the sake of politeness. If I feel people are being silly I should be allowed to tell them that. No one should be told they can't be honest; everyone has the right to respect but they also have a right to their opinion. We live in a free world and we shouldn't be afraid to say how we feel just because it might hurt someone's feelings.

I may have taken it a bit too far, and apologies for that.

jonah212121 08-08-2012 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rosco5 (Post 671170)
Sorry, I got offended because I hate being told I can't be critical of anything.

I'm not about being nice for the sake of politeness. If I feel people are being silly I should be allowed to tell them that. No one should be told they can't be honest; everyone has the right to respect but they also have a right to their opinion. We live in a free world and we shouldn't be afraid to say how we feel just because it might hurt someone's feelings.

I may have taken it a bit too far, and apologies for that.

I agree. to a point..... you make your point and then leave it. i agree we shouldn't have to 'Molly coddle' if i put something poor up i hope people would tell me.

pllefrancois 08-08-2012 11:53 PM

no problem about it, you are being polite and respectful. Your advice is more then welcome said the way it is said.

pllefrancois 08-08-2012 11:54 PM

thank you. Your advice is welcome here. It's the attitude that is not. Telling someone a part of is past is a lie without even knowing the guy is rude. thank you for apologizing

JacobInk 09-08-2012 07:49 AM

did she draw the samoan on as well? is that why you want to mix the the styles?


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